Forum Home » Sound Reinforcement » LAB Lounge » Outdoor PA - Bang for Buck (and weight)
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| Re: Outdoor PA - Bang for Buck (and weight) [message #320260 is a reply to message #319978 ] |
Tue, 06 May 2008 20:13   |
 Sean Chen
Messages: 133
Registered: February 2008 |
Has No Life |
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| Scott Smith wrote on Tue, 06 May 2008 08:08 |
| Sean Chen wrote on Mon, 05 May 2008 21:15 |
...I think the MRX 512 sounds great until you put it next to an SRX 712m.
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I spent quite a bit of time directly comparing these two models, and the difference were subtle and very minor. The 512 had a fuller sound, the 712 was slightly stronger in upper mid-vocal range, but a little thinner overall. I could not justify DOUBLE the price for the minor differences, plus I wanted something that could serve double duty like small FOH applications if needed. The 512 is not bi-ampable, which is where the 712 may shine (this was NOT an option I needed). I would NOT use the 712 for FOH because they are as I said, a little thin on the low end. Their biggest asset is their extremely small size, but that compromises their low end. I was able to buy twice as many 512's (on my budget), and like everyone else here that owns them... I love them.
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That's good for you Scott. I wish I could convince my ears they sound almost the same, that way I didn't have to spend so much. I will only need to use the SRX 712 along with subs, so having no low-end is a perfect fit for me. On the other hand, don't spank me, but I found the MRX sounding similar to the JRX I had previously. I did find MRX and JRX difference to be subtle. In fact, JRX after auto-EQ sounds bettern than MRX natively, to my ears. But it's just my ears.
[Updated on: Tue, 06 May 2008 20:18]
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| Re: Outdoor PA - Bang for Buck (and weight) [message #321290 is a reply to message #319681 ] |
Fri, 09 May 2008 16:42 |
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Seems JBL is doing a $50 rebate per cabinet - starting to look attractive. (that pays for me to get covers for them all)
If I can keep them in good condition I should have no trouble selling them and upgrading to something active (or better quality) in the next year or two.
What could I expect placing a pair of MRX512M cabinets up front (on a XTi2000) with a pair of LS700p Yorkville subs?
How about 2 MRX512M cabs per side on the same amp?
1 pair of cabinets bridged at 4 ohms gives me 1,000 watts per cabinet.
2 pair of cabinets, stereo at 4 ohms a side gives me 400 watts per cabinet.
Can I place a set of cabinets side by side with 70x70 horns outside?
Or should I set one upside down?
Endorsing Artist for CA Guitars - Lafayette, LA
http://www.CAguitars.com
Multitude Audio
Subcontracting under Magnolia Music Center
Audio Visual Installation and Service
Gulfport, Ocean Springs and Pascagula, MS
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| Re: Outdoor PA - Bang for Buck (and weight) [message #321303 is a reply to message #321290 ] |
Fri, 09 May 2008 17:25 |
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Or - should I go with a single pair of SRX 712M. (1 per side on the same XTi2000)
I've read that the SRX has better high end distance and clarity than the MRX. But I've also heard that the MRX 712M has better low end, for what its worth.
Endorsing Artist for CA Guitars - Lafayette, LA
http://www.CAguitars.com
Multitude Audio
Subcontracting under Magnolia Music Center
Audio Visual Installation and Service
Gulfport, Ocean Springs and Pascagula, MS
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| Re: Outdoor PA - Bang for Buck (and weight) [message #321359 is a reply to message #321351 ] |
Fri, 09 May 2008 21:51 |
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| Shane Smith wrote on Fri, 09 May 2008 21:22 |
| Rain Jaudon wrote on Fri, 09 May 2008 23:25 |
Or - should I go with a single pair of SRX 712M. (1 per side on the same XTi2000)
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Apologies in advance if I've misunderstood you, but I sure hope to God you don't mean running an SRX712M on each side of an XTi2000 in Stereo mode? 
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sorry - should have gone on to say BRIDGE MODE -
That would be 1,000 watts per cabinet.
And yes, there will be a 700 watt sub below each top.(although I know the latest trend is to power ally them down the middle)
So what do ya think?
Should I save boocoo cash and get a pair of MRX512m and the 2nd sub?
(I currently only have 1 powered sub)
Should I spend a bit more and get two pair of MRX512m.
Or Go ahead and start building the nicer SRX rig by starting with a pair of SRX712M and one more sub.
Thats about the budget Im sittin at now.. gigs have already started.. 1 down, 19 more weeks to go!
Endorsing Artist for CA Guitars - Lafayette, LA
http://www.CAguitars.com
Multitude Audio
Subcontracting under Magnolia Music Center
Audio Visual Installation and Service
Gulfport, Ocean Springs and Pascagula, MS
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| Re: Outdoor PA - Bang for Buck (and weight) [message #321422 is a reply to message #321290 ] |
Sat, 10 May 2008 09:23 |
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Scott Smith
Messages: 1188
Registered: May 2005
Location: South Florida |
Has No Life |
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| Rain Jaudon wrote on Fri, 09 May 2008 17:42 |
Seems JBL is doing a $50 rebate per cabinet - starting to look attractive. (that pays for me to get covers for them all)
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Certainly a worthwhile consideration if you are on a budget.
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If I can keep them in good condition I should have no trouble selling them and upgrading to something active (or better quality) in the next year or two.
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Yes...certainly. You may also find that they can serve other needs too.
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...How about 2 MRX512M cabs per side on the same amp?
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This is a good solution if you need a wide coverage area. I tried that for a while though with my 512's, and ultimately went back to using my single MRX515. I am much happier with it than the 2) 512's per side for FOH.
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Can I place a set of cabinets side by side with 70x70 horns outside?
Or should I set one upside down?
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As I said, I did that, and ultimately did not like it. I own 512's and 515's. The 512 is a GREAT monitor, and does well in small venues as FOH. For small outdoor use, as stated, I prefer my MRX515's. I am very happy with them.
You could buy the 512's, and when it's time for you to upgrade, just move them to monitor duty. Or buy the 515 and upgrade later. If you could afford it though, the SRX715 would be the BEST choice. Not everyone can afford that option...
"Percussive Maintenance" - Bang on it until it works!
Scott Smith, South Florida
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| Re: Outdoor PA - Bang for Buck (and weight) [message #321430 is a reply to message #321423 ] |
Sat, 10 May 2008 09:54 |
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| Rob Spence wrote on Sat, 10 May 2008 09:31 |
| Rain Jaudon wrote on Fri, 09 May 2008 22:51 |
And yes, there will be a 700 watt sub below each top.(although I know the latest trend is to power ally them down the middle.
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Power alley is what you get when you put the subs under the tops.
Putting them in the center (or all together somewhere) is aimed at reducing the power alley effect.
Read Bennet's stuff on it.
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argh - I knew that!
Had two 4 yr olds and a 16 month old demanding my attention when I was typing that up.
Thanks for clearing it up-
HAHA!
Rain
Endorsing Artist for CA Guitars - Lafayette, LA
http://www.CAguitars.com
Multitude Audio
Subcontracting under Magnolia Music Center
Audio Visual Installation and Service
Gulfport, Ocean Springs and Pascagula, MS
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| Re: Outdoor PA - Bang for Buck (and weight) [message #321571 is a reply to message #321359 ] |
Sat, 10 May 2008 21:38 |
Sean Chen
Messages: 133
Registered: February 2008 |
Has No Life |
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| Rain Jaudon wrote on Fri, 09 May 2008 21:51 |
| Shane Smith wrote on Fri, 09 May 2008 21:22 |
| Rain Jaudon wrote on Fri, 09 May 2008 23:25 |
Or - should I go with a single pair of SRX 712M. (1 per side on the same XTi2000)
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Apologies in advance if I've misunderstood you, but I sure hope to God you don't mean running an SRX712M on each side of an XTi2000 in Stereo mode?
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sorry - should have gone on to say BRIDGE MODE -
That would be 1,000 watts per cabinet.
And yes, there will be a 700 watt sub below each top.(although I know the latest trend is to power ally them down the middle)
So what do ya think?
Should I save boocoo cash and get a pair of MRX512m and the 2nd sub?
(I currently only have 1 powered sub)
Should I spend a bit more and get two pair of MRX512m.
Or Go ahead and start building the nicer SRX rig by starting with a pair of SRX712M and one more sub.
Thats about the budget Im sittin at now.. gigs have already started.. 1 down, 19 more weeks to go!
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1000W per SRX 712m is plenty of power if you have subs. I tried my combo with 1200W per SRX 712m, I cannot play music at full capacity without hurting my ears. For your setup, 1000W per cabinet is good enough, especially if your subs are 700W each.
However, you do lose stereo. To do stereo, you will either need another amp and bridge each amp for each SRX 712, or get a RMX 5050.
There are really more choices than the 2 JBL series you are looking at. A popular cabinet is the Yorkville Unity 15. It will cost a little more than SRX, but it is more power efficient, and it's a 4 Ohm speaker in passive mode. With your XTI 2000, you will send 800W to each in stereo, which is around the recommened power for this speaker. The 60 deg conical Unity horn of the U15 project pretty well over distance, but probably not as well as SRX 712's 90x50 horn.
I think MRX is an excellent product for certain applications. Since you already have some, why not try it out at the park and see if it works for you. I do find the 70 deg. wave guide of MRX to lose its definition over distance, but then again it's just me. It definitely makes it a better instrumentalist's monitor than SRX 712. For vocal monitoring though, I will take the SRX 712 any day.
Oh, and if you are considering PRX, make sure you listen to the QSC HPR stuff before shelling your cash. The HPR 153i 3-way should work pretty well for your park. The HPR 122i won't project that far.
[Updated on: Sat, 10 May 2008 21:53]
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| Re: Outdoor PA - Bang for Buck (and weight) [message #321573 is a reply to message #321356 ] |
Sat, 10 May 2008 21:39 |
Sean Chen
Messages: 133
Registered: February 2008 |
Has No Life |
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| Shane Smith wrote on Fri, 09 May 2008 21:28 |
| Sean Chen wrote on Wed, 07 May 2008 02:16 |
Drive Rack PA crosses between the SRX 718s and SRX 712m as follows:
712m gets a high pass above 90 Hz
718s gets a low pass below 80 Hz
Between 80 Hz and 90 Hz is where both gradually cross over.
I did find this default set-up to be un-punchy. I will have to experiment with different setting.
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I just saved a load of presets on the Itech with various crossover points 70, 80, 90, 100, 110, 120Hz and just experiment at the gig, see which audibly sounds best. I find myself going for either 90 or 100.
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Is it 100 for the 712 high pass, or 100 for the 718 low pass?
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| Re: Outdoor PA - Bang for Buck (and weight) [message #321601 is a reply to message #321571 ] |
Sat, 10 May 2008 22:47 |
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| Sean Chen wrote on Sat, 10 May 2008 21:38 |
1000W per SRX 712m is plenty of power if you have subs. I tried my combo with 1200W per SRX 712m, I cannot play music at full capacity without hurting my ears. For your setup, 1000W per cabinet is good enough, especially if your subs are 700W each.
However, you do lose stereo. To do stereo, you will either need another amp and bridge each amp for each SRX 712, or get a RMX 5050.
There are really more choices than the 2 JBL series you are looking at. A popular cabinet is the Yorkville Unity 15. It will cost a little more than SRX, but it is more power efficient, and it's a 4 Ohm speaker in passive mode. With your XTI 2000, you will send 800W to each in stereo, which is around the recommened power for this speaker. The 60 deg conical Unity horn of the U15 project pretty well over distance, but probably not as well as SRX 712's 90x50 horn.
I think MRX is an excellent product for certain applications. Since you already have some, why not try it out at the park and see if it works for you. I do find the 70 deg. wave guide of MRX to lose its definition over distance, but then again it's just me. It definitely makes it a better instrumentalist's monitor than SRX 712. For vocal monitoring though, I will take the SRX 712 any day.
Oh, and if you are considering PRX, make sure you listen to the QSC HPR stuff before shelling your cash. The HPR 153i 3-way should work pretty well for your park. The HPR 122i won't project that far.
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Thanks for the info. This weekend Im trying a set of the MRX512m cabs up front on the Xti2000. Borrowed a set of Mackie 450 active cabs to fill in for monitors.
(hoping the weather holds)
I don't think I will be unhappy with either cabinet (SRX or MRX) and after hearing the SRX on 400 watts Friday I am certain I will rarely (if ever) run these at full power.. But nice to have the headroom.
I also was able to demo the QSC HPR 122i over the active sub.
INCREDIBLE sound but I get the impression it would not be adequate for outdoors. Indoors, a whole different story.
But that too is a rather heavy system (and the sub is a monster compared to others I've looked at).
Depending on how I feel about the pair of MRX cabs tomorrow, I'll probably either go with a single pair of SRX (till I can afford another pair) or two pair of MRX.
Keep ya posted
Rain
[Updated on: Sat, 10 May 2008 22:48]
Endorsing Artist for CA Guitars - Lafayette, LA
http://www.CAguitars.com
Multitude Audio
Subcontracting under Magnolia Music Center
Audio Visual Installation and Service
Gulfport, Ocean Springs and Pascagula, MS
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